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CURCUMIN? – IS IT THE NEXT BEST THING...?

Posted: Wed Sep 25, 2019 8:29 pm
by MPN-MATE Admin
Hey all my MPN colleagues & friends...

Thought that you might all enjoy a quick scan of this article on Curcumin, that seems to suggest that its powers might be just what the Pharmacist decided not to order... because it is possibly much less expensive than its well publicised rivals: i.e.: HU, Interferon & Jakafi... to name a few...

While all of this article's testing is granted a "small cohort of participants w/ the JAK2+ mutation"

It does hold promise based upon its early results.

Hopefully, we might see further testing and larger cohorts into the Not To Distant Future? "Watch this space!"

Best

Steve

Article:

Curcumin induces apoptosis in JAK2‐mutated cells by the inhibition of JAK2/STAT and mTORC1 pathways


Abstract

Myeloproliferative neoplasms are chronic myeloid cancers divided in Philadelphia positive and negative. The JAK2 V617F is the most common mutation in Philadelphia negative patients and results in a constitutive activation of the JAK/STAT pathway, conferring a proliferative advantage and apoptosis inhibition. Recent studies identified a functional crosstalk between the JAK/STAT and mTOR pathways. The identification of an effective therapy is often difficult, so the availability of new therapeutic approaches might be attractive. Previous studies showed that curcumin, the active principle of the Curcuma longa, can suppress JAK2/STAT pathways in different type of cancer and injuries. In this study, we investigated the anti‐proliferative and pro‐apoptotic effects of curcumin in JAK2 V617F‐mutated cells. HEL cell line and cells from patients JAK2 V617F mutated have been incubated with increasing concentrations of curcumin for different time. Apoptosis and proliferation were evaluated. Subsequently, JAK2/STAT and AKT/mTOR pathways were investigated at both RNA and protein levels. We found that curcumin induces apoptosis and inhibition of proliferation in HEL cells. Furthermore, we showed that curcumin inhibits JAK2/STAT and mTORC1 pathways in JAK2 V617F‐mutated cells. This inhibition suggests that curcumin could represent an alternative strategy to be explored for the treatment of patients with myeloproliferative neoplasms.

CONCLUSION
"In conclusion, this study showed that curcumin exerts an antitumor effect on human JAK2‐mutated cells by inducing apoptosis and inhibition of proliferation, through the regulation of both JAK2/STAT and mTORC1 pathways.These findings suggest that curcumin seems to be a promising nutraceutical compound that should be further evaluated in different pharmaceutical formulation for the treatment of MPNs."
REFERENCE

J essica Petiti_et al_2019. "Curcumin induces apoptosis in JAK2‐mutated cells by the inhibition of JAK2/STAT and mTORC1 pathways"
Department of Clinical and Biological Sciences, University of Turin, Turin, Italy; Department of Oncology, University of Turin, Turin, Italy;
SSD Transfusional Center, San Luigi Gonzaga Hospital, Turin, Italy:(Mar. 06, 2019). DOI: 10.1111/jcmm.14326

https://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/epd ... jcmm.14326 (Direct Link)

Re: CURCUMIN? – IS IT THE NEXT BEST THING...?

Posted: Mon Oct 07, 2019 4:16 am
by ArminD
Hello,
I am a mpn patient from Germany with PV, thanks for sharing this interesting article.
A problem of such studies often is that cell cultures do react different than an organism. And here one of the biggest problem is to get the curcumin into the blood as it is not well adsorbed by the intestine. It is helpful to heat it in oil with 10 % of black pepper (piperin) to increase the availability for the body.
I did so some experiments with curcuma in the past and did not see any strong effect. As I do experiment since several years with natural ingredients and some success on the symptom side as well as reduced phleobotomies (from 4-5 to 1-2 per year) I was surprised to see this positive report on curcuma and will give it a second chance.

Re: CURCUMIN? – IS IT THE NEXT BEST THING...?

Posted: Mon Oct 07, 2019 6:49 am
by MPN-MATE Admin
Hey Armin... :-)

And please accept a very warm welcome from MATES. Great to be hearing from you too...

Yes, the issue of bioavailability has been previously mentioned, however, in this small cohort of MPN patient participants... All of them did seem to derive a benefit also.

Personally, I too have recently recommenced taking Curcumin to see if it might help with inflammation in particular.

We shall have to revisit this Topic in say another Six (6) months or so, to reevaluate the effects. Many have previously stated positive results.

Best wishes again Armin, and welcome to MATEs.

Steve

Post ET / MF - CALR+ Type2 - ASXL1+

Re: CURCUMIN? – IS IT THE NEXT BEST THING...?

Posted: Fri Oct 11, 2019 11:38 am
by Hunter5582
Greetings from Harpers Ferry, West Virginia - USA. I had seen this article and reviewed with interest. I started using Curcumin several years ago to deal with chronic osteoarthritis. It worked better than any NSAID I ever took. I have not taken a NSAID in over three years - did not need to once I found a reliable bioavailable blend of Turmeric-Curcumin. I was not surprised to learn that Curcumin may act directly on the JAK-STAT pathway. It is good to see some research that supports my own positive experience.

There is a lot of credible research out there about the role that the JAK2 mutation plays in increasing the production of inflammatory cytokines. The cytokine overload appears to be responsible for many of the secondary symptoms we experience. My own inflammation-related conditions include: osteoarthritis, GERD, eczema, insomnia. Add to that unexplained intermittent: hypercalcemia, sinus tachycardia, spikes in hypertension, and occasional prediabetes glucose levels. Started seeing an Integrative Medicine specialist recently who thinks much of this is related to systemic inflammation.

I am hopeful we can continue to find some viable means to deal with the symptoms of our MPNs that are not so hard on our bodies. I know that not everyone buys the viability of supplements like Curcumin, but I have to say it has done wonders for me. It is important to realize that the supplement market is not well regulated, so finding a reliable source is really important. I found a brand at my local Walmart that really works. Spring Valley - Turmeric-Curcumin 550mg - with CurcuWIN. Turns out that the CurcuWIN blend is what the Integrative Medicine doc recommends. This additive is available from multiple brands.

I am liking this forum. It is a great resource.

Re: CURCUMIN? – IS IT THE NEXT BEST THING...?

Posted: Sun Oct 13, 2019 7:36 am
by socrates_8
Morning Hunter5582... 8-)

From what I am hoping will be a sunny (but very fresh) Sydney AM. I am off to do some marketing Awareness for MPNs this AM at one of our local Fairs/ Markets.

I have heard that Virginia is a special part of the USA by friends who have been there, I have not unfortunately. I do have a sister that has lived in California for almost 50 years now I guess... But that's nowhere near Harper's Ferry... Hopefully, she will visit before our mother becomes much older (84). I am also my mother's full-time carer at present, as she is partially immobile...

Anyways, thank you for your vote of confidence in MATES Forum. I have not Posted as much this week as I have quite a few things transpiring at the present. One of them in particular may also pique your curiosity ... Promise to tell you more about it shortly, it is to do with trying a new drug to reduce my platelets as nothing else seems to be working for me at the present... Sadly, Curcumin is not having the desired effect in my own case thus far...

Like all things I guess, we are all just a tad different...

Anyways, once my blood results are returned I will fill in some more of the details for you...

I must really dash now as I still have some preparations to complete for the Fair...

Hopefully some of the others will chime in shortly...

Best wishes Hunter5582...

Steve

Re: CURCUMIN? – IS IT THE NEXT BEST THING...?

Posted: Sun Oct 13, 2019 11:32 am
by Hunter5582
Curcumin never seems to have had much impact on hematopoiesis for me, but it sure had made a big difference in inflammation. Best treatment for osteoarthritis that I ever used. I actually find the secondary MPN symptoms more bothersome than the direct impact of the PV. Never had any thrombosis, though I have had some increased tendency towards hemorrhage. All of the JAK2 related inflammatory cytokine issues are way more troublesome for me.

I hope you find something more workable. Also hoping for good news with your upcoming labs. I would offer a thought regarding a different way to approach treatment. The MPN consultant I use does not favor trying to "sanitize" blood cell numbers. He looks at the actual symptoms each patient is experiencing and individualizes treatment. His approach is not the use the "standard protocol" and to focus on what each patient needs. While not "conventional" - he is the Director of the MPN Clinic at Johns Hopkins Hospital (one of the worlds leading medical institutions). He has extensive experience treating MPNs. He published a recent paper in BLOOD (Mat 2019) regarding how he approaches PV treatment. It is summarized in a MPNForum interview. https://mpnforum.com/spivak-how-i-treat-pv/ . While his approach may not work for everyone, it is the approach that I am choosing for myself.

If you ever get over to this side of the planet - Harpers Ferry West Virginia is a beautiful part of the world. Just inside the first ridge of the Blue Ridge Mountains, at the confluence of the Shenandoah and Potomac Rivers the town is historic and an integral part of American history. The State of West Virginia broke away from Virginia during the Civil War and became an independent state. The state has its own culture and while one of the poorest economically, it is one of the richest in sheer beauty.

Hope you get good news soon.

Re: CURCUMIN? – IS IT THE NEXT BEST THING...?

Posted: Fri Oct 18, 2019 4:55 pm
by socrates_8
Hey again Hunter...

Please check out the Methotrexate Post & Updates I have made recently...

viewtopic.php?f=3&t=104

Speak more soon buddy... 8-)

Steve

Re: CURCUMIN? – IS IT THE NEXT BEST THING...?

Posted: Sun Nov 17, 2019 9:29 am
by David
With regard to curcumin. I was diagnosed with jac2 positive mf in the spring of 2018. At that time my hemoglobin was running in the 110-115 range. Over the summer and fall of last year, it began to drop quickly - about 5pts a week. I bottomed out (literally) at around 80 in late Sept/early October, so a year ago. At that time I started 2 things - eprex injections weekly (Erythropoietin, the drug the bike racers allegedly abused) and also I had 2 transfusions as well. As it turned out, the eprex did wonders for me - my hemoglobin counts slowly started going up, and were in the 120 range by mid winter. I started slowing the injection frequency down, and got down to 1 a month for several months. I now haven't had one for 3 months (almost) and my count is around 130. However, what I did do 4 months ago was to start taking curcumin (Sisu full spectrum 40mg) once a day in the morning. I started this because of the article mentioned on this site a few months ago - (https://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/epd ... jcmm.14326) I have no idea for sure if it is the cause, but I think it is entirely possible that the curcumin is the reason I went from once a month to where I am now, and I feel like I am continuing to improve. It's not just my hemoglobin that is improving either - most of the measurables that get tested have improved as well. My platelet count is still in the low 400's, but by this point before it would have been somewhat higher. Red blood cell counts, range variation, etc have all improved. As I said, I don't know for sure if its the curcumin that is doing it, or if it is a result of the long term use of the eprex (the hematologists don't think so) but as long as I am seeming to do better and improve I am going to keep using it.

Re: CURCUMIN? – IS IT THE NEXT BEST THING...?

Posted: Sun Nov 17, 2019 3:44 pm
by MPN-MATE Admin
Hey there David... :D

Really is great to be hearing from you...

That is really interesting news as well concerning the 'Curcumin' and it will be well worth watching to see how you might continue to improve.

I am unsure as to whether or not EPO injections remain in the system, however, I shall try to obtain some feedback along those lines as it could be a really intriguing discover that you may have stumbled over here...

Hopefully also, others might chime in with their own positive commentary...

Generally speaking, and since having made this Post on 'Cucrcumin' most of the feedback has been extremely positive...

Very best wishes David, and please do keep us Posted as to your progress...

Steve

Re: CURCUMIN? – IS IT THE NEXT BEST THING...?

Posted: Sun Nov 17, 2019 3:48 pm
by David
Thanks Steve. I will try and contribute when I can. I am going to post a question to the forum.

Re: CURCUMIN? – IS IT THE NEXT BEST THING...?

Posted: Sat Dec 18, 2021 8:05 pm
by paul.et1996
Hello,
Are there already any long term experiences with Curcumin? I had to stop my Pegasys due to side effects and since 1 month I started with 2x 500mg Curcumin oil (Micelles) per day. My blood values were always normal during Pegasys, I hope to continue this..

Regards Paul ET jak2v617f +

Re: CURCUMIN? – IS IT THE NEXT BEST THING...?

Posted: Sat Dec 18, 2021 11:35 pm
by ArminD
Hi Paul,

I am having a PV but taking curcuma (+ plack pepper heated in oil ~ 5g per day from end of 2015 until end of 2018) then stopped and since two years I take curcumin (with piperin) 2 x 1 g daily. In addition since 2015 continuously a fermented pomegrenade concentrate and sencha (+ 5% black pepper, 2 x ~3.5g per day). The overall effect was a reduction of many PV symptoms and it seems that my allele burden is correlated to the intake of curcumin as it was stable and slightly decreasing (2018: 34%) before I stopped taking curcumin and then increased steeply to 51% (2019) and at present (June 2021) is at 30.8 %. Also motivated by the positive reports on curcumin here in the forum I gave it a second chance, but as capsules of curcumin and not curcuma, and it seems to be worth it. Itching symptoms got even weaker and rarer. 2015 they were really bad and I had night sweats. Night sweats never came back since I started my self treatment in 2015!
I have no problems taking these supplements. My kidney and liver do well tolerate them and also my digestion is fine. Taking curcumin it is better to to split it up for several doses the day as it metabolizes fast. Also I avoid milk products when taking it as milk is often absorbing polyphenols as curcumin.

just to clarify why I take these supplements, My PV (elevated blood values since 1999, diagnosis 2008) was never that bad that my hematologist wanted to prescribe any drugs (except ASS). But the symptoms were so strong that I looked for a solution in 2015. And now I feel better and by blood values get better every year.

Regards Armin PV jak2+, ASS100, 3-4 phlebotomies per year

Re: CURCUMIN? – IS IT THE NEXT BEST THING...?

Posted: Sun Dec 19, 2021 12:24 am
by MPN-MATE Admin
Evening guys... :D

Firstly, welcome to MATES MPN Forum here in Sydney, Australia Paul, (incidentally where are you from?). Great to have you drop by & make a Post / Comment, & especially so on an old favourite that often appeals to a large cohort of MPNers that I have listened to over time... Mostly, all of those remarks were hugely positive in nature concerning the use of Curcumin, & its ability to reduce bodily inflammation.

However, we are all quite different of course... & quite unique it would seem. It is a continuing fascination of mine, to constantly be reminded by so many other MPNers, who might have the same or very similar types of MPNs, & can also be similar w/ other incidentals, age, gender etc. And yet their experiences can be extraordinarily contrasting, the one from the other etc... (?)

Like the Post from my MPN buddy Hunter in West Virginia USA, (aka another Steve), suggests people who suffer from most types of cancers, also apparently suffer from various types of bodily "Inflammation". Curcumin, from most research out there suggests that it can indeed provide some beneficial relief of symptom burden, for many people...

My original Post, does provide a single reference, that does rely on research completed by many others, (within the References). However, and as suggested, results can vary greatly from person to person, (& study to study), as we are all quite unique in our illness, one must be a tad cautious when experimenting w/ medication cessation in favour of, let's say more "Natural remedies".

On the surface, and from most people I have discussed 'Curcumin' w/ over time... Most reports are of a positive generality.

Hunter, is well versed, and is a good person to speak w/ on the topic, as he is following a holistic and integrative method of managing his illness, and he is extremely well read on most topics too...

It seems that not 'ALL' brands of Curcumin, available in the market place, have the same level of 'Bio-availability', (the body's ability to absorb the curcumin at optimum levels), as mentioned by both Hunter, David & Armin too I believe...

Hunter also is/was being treated w/ Pegasys, hence his input as always is invaluable...

Armin, great to be hearing from you again also my friend...

Guys, to you & your families, please stay happy, safe & well and we will all come through this pandemic, w/ a little help from our friends & each other... 8-)

Very best wishes for a happy holiday & prosperous New Year...

Steve

Dx 2016. Post ET / MF. Driver mutation CALR+ Type2. ASXL1+ (HRM). Von Willebrands Syndrome (VWS - acquired?) 62yo.

Re: CURCUMIN? – IS IT THE NEXT BEST THING...?

Posted: Sun Dec 19, 2021 2:01 am
by paul.et1996
Hi Steve and Armin, Thanks for the info! Good to hear that it has an effect. These tests are of course always done in a sterile environment on laboratory dishes without any hindrance from the gastrointestinal tract... But the article about curcumin has caught my attention, unbelievable that a food product can have so many beneficial properties, especially in MPN. The curcumin I use is an oil-encapsulated type which should be absorbed 185x better.. I first discussed the use with my hematologist, he warned that pepper can influence the effect of ascal.. so be careful about this. I divide the intakes over the day, 500mg curcumin oil in the morning, baby aspirin in the afternoon and 500mg curcumin oil again in the evening. Since I had stopped with Pegasys I experienced some typical symptoms, including the spleen. I have noticed that the curcumin significantly suppresses these symptoms. I'll keep you posted here on the progress.. It's also not entirely clear whether I'm going to start with the pegasys again, I'm walking in the hospital for research.. Greetings and a very merry Christmas and a healthy 2022 Greetings Paul (ET since 1993) The Netherlands